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[Discussion] BOINC whitelist monitoring

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I'm a relatively new person to Gridcoin, so I might be looking at this from an outsider's perspective, but I'm wondering whether in the long term, there's any plan to overhaul the whitelisting/blacklisting system for individual projects. (I'm aware that there is some kind of plan for automatic greylisting of dormant projects, but I'm talking about the system overall.) At the moment, as I understand, individual projects are whitelisted, presumably after a poll/vote for most of them, and then the GRC credits are split equally among the whitelisted projects. However, this means that people working on projects with only a few other people get a relatively higher proportion of the GRC credits, which may be seen as unfair. If everyone was to simply work on the projects earning the highest GRC credits, the system would cause the computation to be roughly equally split between all the whitelisted projects.

 

My view is: why not let the Gridcoin community itself decide the split of credits? My question therefore is: is it possible to devise a calculation to equitably decide this? Obviously, if all the projects were simply CPU/GPU intensive, then this would not be too difficult, as long as the data were available on who crunched how many work units etc. for how long. However, it might be more complex than this, as I am aware that some projects are not CPU focussed, and there might be other factors involved, or security considerations or anti-cheat mechanisms which I haven't considered.

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I'm a relatively new person to Gridcoin, so I might be looking at this from an outsider's perspective, but I'm wondering whether in the long term, there's any plan to overhaul the whitelisting/blacklisting system for individual projects. (I'm aware that there is some kind of plan for automatic greylisting of dormant projects, but I'm talking about the system overall.) At the moment, as I understand, individual projects are whitelisted, presumably after a poll/vote for most of them, and then the GRC credits are split equally among the whitelisted projects. However, this means that people working on projects with only a few other people get a relatively higher proportion of the GRC credits, which may be seen as unfair. If everyone was to simply work on the projects earning the highest GRC credits, the system would cause the computation to be roughly equally split between all the whitelisted projects.

 

My view is: why not let the Gridcoin community itself decide the split of credits? My question therefore is: is it possible to devise a calculation to equitably decide this? Obviously, if all the projects were simply CPU/GPU intensive, then this would not be too difficult, as long as the data were available on who crunched how many work units etc. for how long. However, it might be more complex than this, as I am aware that some projects are not CPU focussed, and there might be other factors involved, or security considerations or anti-cheat mechanisms which I haven't considered.

https://cryptocointalk.com/topic/38994-magnitude-multiplier/

The idea is controversial to say the least.


^ Smash that upvote button! ;D

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Poll for vote out SAT, Mindmodeling and CSG have expired with best answer yes to all.

 

Could we change the whitelist?


Feel free to join Gridcoin Community Discord we have an irc-bridge, price-bot, and some more also a BOINC community Discord up for test with a channel for each project.

Contact me if you have any suggestions or problems to this.

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BURP

 

They have some job listed but have failed Automatic Check and some sessions got stuck do to an bug in the upload handler.


 

There would never be any guarantee to have new work or have work units all times as like some other projects. There are times when they got bigger job to fullfill the demands of task

and at somepoint it would get dry. There have been times like this before and it have been fine, but to improve the reward mecanism we would need a greylist system to this project or make a vote

each time it get dry or getting a longterm downtimes.

 

There could be new job at any time and the bug might get fixed after new year.

 

So we would need your voice, should it stay?

 

We got a request to make a poll and got it ready, but would like some feedback.

 

EDIT:Poll have been created

Edited by 47an

Feel free to join Gridcoin Community Discord we have an irc-bridge, price-bot, and some more also a BOINC community Discord up for test with a channel for each project.

Contact me if you have any suggestions or problems to this.

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I think we should make a greylisting system based on:

1. Project has no new WUs for x days. Resulting in greylisting for x days and no rewards for it.

2a. As soon as project gets new work they are back in again for rewards.

2b. If project has no work for x days it gets of the rewards list completely and needs to be voted in again.

 

I propose numbers to be something in the region of no work for 7-21 days it gets greylisted and on there for up to 60-90 days before it gets taken of completely.

Edited by startail

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As we need to a code attach to that i could follow that range in to poll.

Then i start the poll today with time range of 14 days and greylist start 4 Jan 2017 if they had no new task. From this timezone it is now 21 Dec.

if no solid flow of workunits set false
if no solid flow of workunits after 90 days from 21 Dec remove project
as to best answer:yes we would agree to follow these rule as attach greylisting.

(to be solid it should be able to send task in a time range of 1 week without no more then total of ~12 hours interruption for each week.)

 

(This will be a rule only for this project and for this poll. in this time range for set it to false and to be not listed, would not be to agree to greylistling later on. Would be to greylisted until blacklisted but not back to whitelist if it reach 90 days.)

 

Later on we might be able to handle it auto in Neural Network or an attach system to set true/false, but today it is impossible and would require a lot of work.
Today we reach info from a bot at #Gridcoin freenode and we could get a history when there are issue with servers or low amount of task available.

EDIT: Poll have been created

 

EDIT: Set day for when greylist proposal would be.

Edited by 47an

Feel free to join Gridcoin Community Discord we have an irc-bridge, price-bot, and some more also a BOINC community Discord up for test with a channel for each project.

Contact me if you have any suggestions or problems to this.

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@47an

thanks for creating the poll (until January 4)

 

people can see here how to vote:

https://steemit.com/gridcoin/@erkan/gridcoin-whitelist-should-boinc-project-burp-be-removed


@GridcoinIRC (freshest news) / help with Gridcoin tasks / team challenges: August  / BOINC admin interviews / VOTE in polls / ... / Wanna thank Erkan?

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BURP

 

They have some job listed but have failed Automatic Check and some sessions got stuck do to an bug in the upload handler.

Bug https://burp.renderfarming.net/forum_thread.php?id=2888#14785

 

There would never be any guarantee to have new work or have work units all times as like some other projects. There are times when they got bigger job to fullfill the demands of task

and at somepoint it would get dry. There have been times like this before and it have been fine, but to improve the reward mecanism we would need a greylist system to this project or make a vote

each time it get dry or getting a longterm downtimes.

 

There could be new job at any time and the bug might get fixed after new year.

 

So we would need your voice, should it stay?

 

We got a request to make a poll and got it ready, but would like some feedback.

 

EDIT:Poll have been created

 

As 47an pointed out, the fact that BURP rendering sessions are created by users does raise the possibility that the project can run out of work if there aren't enough session submissions. That is a good argument for an automatic greylist.

 

As a contribution to the discussion of "Should BURP be removed from the whitelist" I would like to make the following points:

-BURP currently has work and a good list of sessions in the Admin Accept queue so the project will have plenty of work in the near future.

-The Automatic Check system is a new feature, until now all submissions have been manually checked by the project administrator before being accepted which took a significant amount of time. Automatic checking has increased the acceptance rate for sessions thus reducing the likelihood that the project will run out of work.

-The Upload Handler bug noted by 47an has only affected a small percentage of submitted sessions (45 sessions over 5 years), sessions are still being accepted. Lost sessions result in a poor user-experience for the contributors but most of the BURP interface is still considered to be a beta-test so users should be aware that some bugs exist.

-Be aware that ALL sessions in the Automatic Check queue listed in the Server Status page will display "error" in the Renderer column as the render is not chosen until after the automatic check process. The Renderer column is not relevant to the Automatic Checker, it is a symptom of using the existing list template for an early implementation of the Automatic Checker interface.

-Some BURP sessions are restricted to specific platforms or memory sizes so even if a user is not getting work because of their system configuration the project may still have work (at the time of writing this post only Mac and Linux clients are in use).

 

I see the issues raised with BURP as fuel for broader discussions on the merits of having an automatic grey list or whether to include beta projects in the whitelist but unless BURP is negatively impacting the gridcoin system at present I don't see a need remove it.

Edited by LumenDan

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Feel free to join Gridcoin Community Discord we have an irc-bridge, price-bot, and some more also a BOINC community Discord up for test with a channel for each project.

Contact me if you have any suggestions or problems to this.

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