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The thing I was looking at with regards to shareholders/voting was being able to attribute "votes" to a unique individual as best as possible from the pool of participating members.  members listed in team "gridcoin" is one way of doing this since they have registered boinc accounts but if we broaden this in some manner to "investors" who aren't running boinc and are just doing the wallet/client, not sure how we can track who voted, were multiple votes cast, did they create another "wallet ID" and vote multiple times etc.

 

Trying to have a fair voting system of legitimate registered "unique people" that can't be "gamed" because of the anonymity factor in the coin transactions/generation......  (prevent voting fraud)

 

An informal poll on a forum is not "voting" from a business/corporation standpoint, especially if directors need to be periodically voted on, or expenditures potentially approved.

 

Tracking it likewise in a forum also isn't ideal because what if someone deleted or moved a post and such-  Needs to be kept in official "meeting minutes" and such.  (unalterable- in a locked PDF format ideally)

 

Mike

Edited by MikeK

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There are costs each year to maintain an entity and unless you use something like Legalzoom you will need an attorney as your registered agent.  It would be nice to have a real attorney to be available to consult with as the agent but I don't think that is worth the cost at this point.  When GRC has a $1Bill market cap in the near future it would be a necessity though.  From my experience using Legalzoom as your registered agent is ~$400 per year and you have to file an annual business report for the state.  We would also need to register the business as a trademark nationally (USPTO) so someone in a different state couldn't open up the same business name.  This would also have annual filing requirements and fees.

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But isn't this one of the use cases for the tickets system, where everybody can vote from their wallet and the weight of their vote is by how many GRC they have? 

 

This system would not have any possibility of fraud.

I wouldn't do the ticket system for something like that.  It would be a mess and likely not meet the needed reporting requirements.

 

One way to fraud it would be simply to create multiple wallets.  Vote, transfer coins to another wallet, vote, etc...  = multiple votes =fraud.

Edited by MikeK

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Whoa... Let's not ahead of ourselves.

 

Eventually, incorporating a business entity will be necessary (or not, depending on situations) but at this moment in time, it doesn't make much sense. Yes, sometimes, it's better to have the foundations set right so as to prevent future chaos and have a clear line of sight. This topic will require much thinking and planning as there are much things to consider. eg. Crytocurrency does not have country barriers like that of a traditional business. Different country, different laws & regulations, what applies to you may not apply to someone else... etcetera.

 

Ideally, the Foundation should be an UN like entity, and not just a business entity that is registered in a certain country.


Gridcoin - Paving the Way Towards a Better Tomorrow

GRC: SJgRQKZp19AG49bPwmoJyWQCHpd6CfTzKg || BTC: 13pTr3qXWDvycRLBPgt3bJzJst4ju46CGS

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Even the UN has an approved, ratified charter detailing it's operations and scope...

 

http://www.un.org/en/documents/charter/

 

Gridcoin and similar foundations are more like non-profit business entities than governmental authorities.

 

Technically,  every country in the UN is ratified internally by each country and then registered with the US Government....

 

 

 

 

CHAPTER XIX: RATIFICATION AND SIGNATURE Article 110  

  1. The present Charter shall be ratified by the signatory states in accordance with their respective constitutional processes.
  2. The ratifications shall be deposited with the Government of the United States of America, which shall notify all the signatory states of each deposit as well as the Secretary-General of the Organization when he has been appointed.
  3. The present Charter shall come into force upon the deposit of ratifications by the Republic of China, France, the Union of Soviet Socialist Republics, the United Kingdom of Great Britain and Northern Ireland, and the United States of America, and by a majority of the other signatory states. A protocol of the ratifications deposited shall thereupon be drawn up by the Government of the United States of America which shall communicate copies thereof to all the signatory states.
  4. The states signatory to the present Charter which ratify it after it has come into force will become original Members of the United Nations on the date of the deposit of their respective ratifications.

Article 111  

The present Charter, of which the Chinese, French, Russian, English, and Spanish texts are equally authentic, shall remain deposited in the archives of the Government of the United States of America. Duly certified copies thereof shall be transmitted by that Government to the Governments of the other signatory states.

 

 

 

 

All those members also pay dues/fees, contribute to the budget and operations of the UN as an entity also and has voting, recordkeeping, documentation and process requirements not dissimilar to what a business would need to do...

 

Definitely not a UN-like entity.....

 

Mike

Edited by MikeK

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Actually we would need to do this like ASAP based on how certain states or locations have "advertisting" requirements and regulations.

 

We're transacting business- ads are being run and being paid for out of "the foundation"... We're a business...

 

New Hampshire for example

 

What are the consequences of not registering my business?
You do not have the authority to conduct any business (including advertising) under any name other than your own personal legal name until that name is registered with this office.  The Secretary of State’s office is not an enforcement agency.  However, not registering can have consequences with other agencies or institutions.

 

Some other business resources...

 

https://www.sba.gov/content/register-with-state-agencies

 

I say this because, in not doing so, I don't want anyone as an individual to then unknowingly incur some potential liability.

 

Mike

Edited by MikeK

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Ok, let's register in Panama  :P

 

http://www.offshoreinfo.com/panama.htm

 

Edit: And why Panama?

http://www.offshoreinfo.com/why_panama.htm

Edited by sEpuLchEr

Gridcoin - Paving the Way Towards a Better Tomorrow

GRC: SJgRQKZp19AG49bPwmoJyWQCHpd6CfTzKg || BTC: 13pTr3qXWDvycRLBPgt3bJzJst4ju46CGS

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lol-   :)  I'm just bringing it up now because these are all significant considerations to protect people "as individuals" from any potential liabilities..

 

Likewise, when registration of the business occurs, it should be planned for to obtain some D & O/Liability insurance as well....  Currency and "monetary value" is being created and transacted with.  At some point someone cries foul and gets a lawyer involved.

 

^^ounce of prevention right here to prevent the pound or pounds of cure....

 

Anyone Panamanian who knows about Panama laws and statutes? LOL

 

Mike

Edited by MikeK

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Yes, I agree and fully understand. But like what RTM has mentioned. We are in a special zone or rather out of zone. GRC has no borders, so which country's law are we supposed to abide to?

 

Panama ATM is the perfect place. Or is there a central Earth agency we can register with? I'm not trying to be funny but you do see where I'm coming from?


Gridcoin - Paving the Way Towards a Better Tomorrow

GRC: SJgRQKZp19AG49bPwmoJyWQCHpd6CfTzKg || BTC: 13pTr3qXWDvycRLBPgt3bJzJst4ju46CGS

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Regardless of where you register initially, you need to pick somewhere.  Then after you do that, you may need to investigate if there's any other requirements for doing business "outside" of that country, in other countries for example.

 

 

Good Starting points for info...

 

http://www.usa.gov/Business/Foreign-Business.shtml

 

http://www.venable.com/files/Event/8b286899-5016-4886-a5d4-d4b792fb29c1/Presentation/EventAttachment/e7806028-ca6f-4fa9-ac00-7c7bbed5fc16/Overseas_Operations_Presentation.pdf

 

 

Rob- of significance above-  The intellectual property part.  It's nice that it's "open source" but do you want gridcoin to have it's own "intellectual property" that's protected in some manner?  If so, then the place where you "register and incorporate" would need to be looked at for how IP get's protected and handled...  (including trademarks and logo's and such)

 

Mike

Edited by MikeK

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BTW-  all of the above and how it gets handled (or not) will also affect the perception of how people view this cryptocurrency, what it's "legitimacy" is, and how this foundation intends to operate and behave.

 

 

Example-  "Shitcoin" -  anonymous dudes on the internet, no idea who he is, pumping out code from his basement, trying to make a quick buck, then vanishes from the face of the planet....

 

Legitimate coin-  Registered business with defined operations and goals, named "responsible parties", in it for the "long-haul"

 

Mike

Edited by MikeK

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Mike what you are saying is importaint, I promise its not lost on anyone here. We've delayed/nixed certain ideas/plans because of regulatory guidance in the cryptocurrencyand payment processing space. This is something I have been following very closely personally and professionally. There are also reasons beyond regulatory requirements and liability to set things up properly. Unfortunately, we have limited resources and guidance at this point in time. There isn't much precedence yet and the rules aren't even being written yet, which means we get to be a part of that process. It also means there is a great responsibility to do the right thing and be leaders in the space. A boiler plate solution probably isn't going to work for us but if this is something you are interested in championing keep at it, there is a lot of value in talking/thinking through these things, they never happen as fast as anyone hopes but when dine right they provide a lot of value.

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